A retarded debate

Submitted by Bird Dog on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:09pm. Tags:

After Rahm Emanuel called a group of liberal Democrats "f**king retarded", Sarah Palin made political hay of it, demanding an apology, etc. To me, the whole melee is retarded, and it vaguely reminds me of this interchange.

HEALY: I'm kidding. Yeah, I guess you could call me an architect--it's just a job really, a way to keep me moving. My real passion is my hobby.

MARY: What's that?

HEALY: I work with retards.

MARY: (taken aback) I beg your pardon?

HEALY: You know...(flaps lips with fingers)...the guys who ride the short bus.

MARY: (put off) Isn't that a little politically incorrect?

HEALY: The hell with that. No one's gonna tell me who I can and can't work with.

MARY: No, I mean...

HEALY: There's this one kid, we call him Mongo on account of he's a mongoloid. He got out of his cage once and--

MARY: --He's in a cage?!

HEALY: Well it's more of an enclosure really.

MARY: They keep him confined? That's bullsh*t!

HEALY: That's what I said, so I went out and got him a leash you know, one of those clothesline runners for the backyard. He's got plenty of room out there to dig. The kid's really blossomed. Now I can take him to ball games, movies--you know, happy stuff.

MARY: That sounds like fun.

HEALY: Yeah, it's fun for them, but it's heaven for me...(getting emotional)...Those goofy bastards are just about the best thing I have in this crazy old world.

Much as I dislike him as a Chief of Staff, I have to side with Emanuel on this. Rush Limbaugh, too. Palin's umbrage was fairly ridiculous. Emanuel wasn't derogating Down's Syndrome kids, he was insulting the intelligence of elected politicians, which is both commonly done and well deserved.
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Palin checks on Rush's raise (#205930)
by Desidiosus on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 8:30pm

Hee.

“Our political correct society is acting like some giant insult’s taken place by calling a bunch of people who are retards, retards,” Rush said, adding that Rahm’s meeting yesterday with advocates for the mentally handicapped was a “retard summit at the White House.”

“Governor Palin believes crude and demeaning name calling at the expense of others is disrespectful.”

This is, of course, not inconsistent; Palin's position from the beginning was that her son's disability should be used as a political football.

( )
heh (#205837)
by Username on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 1:47pm

Sarah Palin -- who demanded that White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel be fired for using the word "retarded" -- told Glenn Beck just a few weeks ago that she was worried about the United States turning into a country where people couldn't use words that were "politically incorrect."

http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/axqbw/sarah_palin_who_demanded_that_white_house_chief/

( )
Hoist By Their Own Petard (#205841)
by brutusettu on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 2:03pm

Over-Attributed, Broad-brush, and Wholesale Anti-Anti-Bigoted Talking Points have been a tool of the right for over twenty years now--I have zero problem with them suffering at the hands of their own monster.

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( | parent )
Hoist By Their Own Petard (#205824)
by M Scott Eiland on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:55pm

PC language police have been a tool of the left for over twenty years now--I have zero problem with them suffering at the hands of their own monster.

--

( )
Sarah Palin is a PC monster? (#205844)
by Jordan on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 2:08pm

If you say so....

--

"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
–Voltaire

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Oh man, a twofer today. (#205830)
by Desidiosus on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:59pm

( | parent )
Haha. Try "PATRIOT Act" on for size. (#205828)
by BlaiseP on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:58pm

The Right mongers more Newspeak in an evening than the Left could dream up in a year. Ever watch Fox News?

( | parent )
No one who is related to, friends with, or has worked with (#205818)
by catchy on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:30pm

the mentally or physically challenged uses the word 'retard'.

Sorry that's all PC'd out for you and Limbaugh, but not everything PC is bad -- social pressure not to use pt.less slurs that offend is a good thing.

Can I ask when is the last time you had contact with someone who's handicapped?

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I think the problem solves itself (#205876)
by HankP on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 4:37pm

if no one uses the word to describe people with mental or emotional issues, then the word is freed up to be used against people you disagree with or don't like or think are stupid. "Lunatic" used to refer to mental and emotional issues, since it's not used as a technical term anymore it's free for people to use to describe people like Sarah Palin - at least, I've never heard anyone object to the use of the term. Maybe it's just an issue because we're in a transitional period, but as far as I know "retarded" hasn't been used as a technical term or label for several decades now.

--

I blame it all on the Internet

( | parent )
"Moron", idiot", "cretin" etc used to be classifications (#205888)
by tomsyl on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 5:04pm

based on ranges of subnormal IQ but now they've moved from clinical psychiatry into the vernacular. Anyone who doesn't know that is an imbecile.

--

Sincerity is the first casualty of capitalism. John Burdett

( | parent )
IIRC (#205903)
by hobbesist on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 6:08pm

'Cretin' is the Provencal word for 'Christian' - it was an appellation used to emphasize that these, too, are children of God.

That reminder apparently didn't win out over the discomfort in the face of, and the concomitant urge to mock, those with cognitive disabilities.

--

Bene vixit, bene qui latuit

( | parent )
I thought they were legal terms for opposing counsel nt (#205894)
by HankP on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 5:19pm

.

--

I blame it all on the Internet

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None of those are printable here w/o risking suspension. (#205897)
by tomsyl on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 5:25pm

but most end in -head or -face.

--

Sincerity is the first casualty of capitalism. John Burdett

( | parent )
My wife works with them full-time (#205838)
by Bird Dog on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 1:50pm

And a good friend of mine has a girl with Down's Syndrome, and I see them frequently. I can separate "retards" in Congress from handicapped special needs people quite easily.

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( | parent )
The people in Congress believe they have special needs (#205891)
by tomsyl on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 5:06pm

usually involving dollar signs followed by integers with lots of commas and zeros after them.

--

Sincerity is the first casualty of capitalism. John Burdett

( | parent )
Yep, that's the folks in Congress. (#205908)
by Desidiosus on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 6:58pm

Nobody else, of course, has any need or desire in that way -- and, furthermore, this desire is so new that no one has remarked on its general results in any religious text.

( | parent )
BD's got a point. (#205859)
by Desidiosus on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 3:56pm

After all, you'd never call a "pussy" a "retard." That's just inappropriate usage.

( | parent )
A little more (#205849)
by Bird Dog on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 2:42pm

I just don't think of people with Down's Syndrome and related handicaps as retarded. They're just people who were unfortunately born with developmental disabilities. I reserve the term "retards" to those people who are capable of intelligent thought but don't come close to actually using their brains. In that context, I'm in full agreement with Emanuel.

--

( | parent )
WOuld you use the term in front of your wife (#205852)
by catchy on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 3:00pm

her clients or their families to refer to a non-handicapped person? Would she ever use it?

I take Blaise's point that PC has gotten out of hand and I don't know where you'd draw the line on what terms are OK. Now that I think about it when I worked at a special needs facility they asked us not to use the word 'handicapped'. And that kind of thing is going too far to expect anyone to stay current with all PC language.

I guess 'retard' is still a no-no for me b/c its history is well-known, its connotations ugly, and I don't think you can just erase that.

( | parent )
To answer your first, question, yes (#205864)
by Bird Dog on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 4:12pm

Because my wife knows me after 25 years of marriage. If I use "retards" toward her students, she knows that I'm doing it in a jokey Farrelly Brothers sort of way (and that I'm trying to push a few buttons). For the doofuses who fall well short of fully using their intellects, an unqualified yes. I've heard her use the word, mostly directed to our first-born teenage son, but not toward her students.

As for using the term in front of others, it depends on the audience. A buddy of mine is CEO of a multi-county group that provides mental health services, and using the term isn't an issue. Emanuel using the term in a gathering of fellow Democrats shouldn't be an issue either.

--

( | parent )
OK (#205872)
by catchy on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 4:28pm

I'm a little concerned you guys are in 'anti-PC backlash over-correction' mode, but never mind.

I'm now just a guy with an opinion restricted to my own usage and retract my 1st comment to your diary.

( | parent )
"too far to expect anyone to stay current with all PC language" (#205856)
by Bernard Guerrero on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 3:44pm

From 6:54 on....

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-“It is unwise for the government to tell people how they can spend their money” - Barney Frank, Chairman House Financial Services Committee, on on-line gambling, 2009

( | parent )
That Was A Cute Show (#205955)
by M Scott Eiland on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 9:35pm

A family of rather nice people, caught in the deadly, soul-numbing idiocy of hard left PC thinking. I wouldn't mind having them as friends, though I suspect it would involve a lot of sympathetic wincing.

--

( | parent )
The essence of comedy is empathy. (#205957)
by Desidiosus on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 9:47pm

That's why "King of the Hill" was a good show. The Goode family . . . you never got a sense of the journey these characters had taken to get to where they were. On a basic level, Judge didn't "get" the characters, so there weren't the details which make for good comedy.

( | parent )
oh, i get it now (#205850)
by nilsey on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 2:54pm

its the _target_ that matters to you. the appropriateness of the name calling and lack civility are dependent upon the _target_.

this explains a lot.

( | parent )
No, you don't get it (#205851)
by Bird Dog on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 2:56pm

It's the behavior, not the target. Hope that helps with your lack of understanding.

--

( | parent )
sure, sure. nt (#205853)
by nilsey on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 3:06pm

nt

( | parent )
Well, ya know, there's good 'uns and bad 'uns. (#205845)
by BlaiseP on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 2:16pm

When the Right quits using Democrat as an adjective, that will be a start. If ever there was a collection of retards, it has to be the Fox News Crew. People just eat that stuff up. Sorta like Karl in Sling Blade said about potted meat. It's pretty loud.

The petty whining and false outrage seems to be emitted mostly by the Right Wing these days. Oh sure, there's plenty on the Left, too. But lately, I've been watching Fox News, just to keep up with things over there. Swear to God, it's like another country in there, watching Squarehead Hannity carrying on like Obama was the Antichrist.

This sort of crazy talk is infectious. From Gustave Le Bon:

With respect to the influence that may be exerted by reasoning on the minds of electors, to harbour the least doubt on this subject can only be the result of never having read the reports of an electioneering meeting. In such a gathering affirmations, invectives, and sometimes blows are exchanged, but never arguments. Should silence be established for a moment it is because some one present, having the reputation of a "tough customer," has announced that he is about to heckle the candidate by putting him one of those embarrassing questions which are always the joy of the audience. The satisfaction, however, of the opposition party is shortlived, for the voice of the questioner is soon drowned in the uproar made by his adversaries. The following reports of public meetings, chosen from hundreds of similar examples, and taken from the daily papers, may be considered as typical: --

"One of the organisers of the meeting having asked the assembly to elect a president, the storm bursts. The anarchists leap on to the platform to take the committee table by storm. The socialists make an energetic defence; blows are exchanged, and each party accuses the other of being spies in the pay of the Government, &c. . . . A citizen leaves the hall with a black eye.

"The committee is at length installed as best it may be in the midst of the tumult, and the right to speak devolves upon `Comrade' X.

"The orator starts a vigorous attack on the socialists, who interrupt him with shouts of `Idiot, scoundrel, blackguard!' &c., epithets to which Comrade X. replies by setting forth a theory according to which the socialists are `idiots' or `jokers.'"

"The Allemanist party had organised yesterday evening, in the Hall of Commerce, in the Rue du Faubourg-du-Temple, a great meeting, preliminary to the workers' fête of the 1st of May. The watchword of the meeting was `Calm and Tranquillity!'

"Comrade G -- -- alludes to the socialists as `idiots' and `humbugs.'

At these words there is an exchange of invectives and orators and audience come to blows. Chairs, tables, and benches are converted into weapons," &c., &c.

It is not to be imagined for a moment that this description of discussion is peculiar to a determined class of electors and dependent on their social position. In every anonymous assembly whatever, though it be composed exclusively of highly educated persons, discussion always assumes the same shape. I have shown that when men are collected in a crowd there is a tendency towards their mental levelling at work, and proof of this is to be found at every turn.

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It's been a while (#205832)
by Sulla on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 1:17pm

a man's gotta eat-

Doyle: Hey is this the kind of retard that drools and rubs sh!t in his hair and all that, 'cause I'm gonna have a hard time eatin' 'round that kind of thing now. Just like I am with antique furniture and midgets. You know that, I can't so much as drink a damn glass of water around a midget or a piece of antique furniture.

Linda: Doyle, you're awful. You shouldn't be that way.

Doyle: I ain't saying it's right, I'm just telling the damn truth. He'll make me sick. I know it.

--

"We should not tie the hands of law enforcement in the effort to bring these terrorists to justice"- Leon E. Panetta

( | parent )
It's not out of DSM yet, but getting close. (#205821)
by BlaiseP on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:47pm

All this nomenclature baloney. What we need is macro expansion so's we can hip to the latest PeeCee trends. Intellectually disabled, I think is the term-du-jour. Lunatic was once a euphemism, back when the moon was thought to have some influence.

Every term used of people suffering from mental illness or genetic conditions such as Down's Syndrome or the like has been appropriated by those who want to denigrate others.

Education is particularly obnoxious: "Special Education" and "Individual Education Plan". Oddly the term "segregation" survives, for schools go back and forth about how to educated SpecEd kids. One year, someone complains the SpecEd kids don't have contact with regular classrooms, so they run them all into the regular classroom, this is called "inclusion". When the SpecEd kids drag down the NCLB scores, off they go to the "Seg Class" again.

Which is it this week? African-American? Do you hyphenate it? When did Black stop being okay? Is it okay to capitalize Black? What if a person's black, from Brazil? Still African-American? Folks come in all colors down there, more people worship the Yoruba gods in Brazil than Nigeria now. And what about Cubans? They're pretty dark, too.

And don't get me started on "Jew". We're sposta say "Jewish people".

And the problem isn't unique to English. Don't call a Guatemalan Indian "Indio", we're sposta say "indigenes".

It's all too ridiculous for words. Semantic hooey.

( | parent )
Plus there's the irony that Rahm's fighting to get (#205817)
by Jordan on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:23pm

health reform passed that will help actual disabled kids, while Palin's fighting...well fighting to be sure government doesn't do jack squat for any sick or disabled individuals at least until bills start having an (R) after them again. But God knows it's more important to be PC.

Sarah Palin is policy challenged.

--

"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
–Voltaire

( )
I'd say the irony is (#205820)
by caleb on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:46pm

Palin only wants Some People to " screw political correctness".

Apparently, Rahm is not part of her honored flock.

--

~At times like these I am reminded of the immortal words of Socrates when he said...."I drank what?"

( | parent )
Rahm was fighting to make sure good health reform was not passed (#205819)
by catchy on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:35pm

He kicked the left wing of the party all the way into that Senate bill, which is so much worse than could've been achieved it's officially policy-challenged.

I don't see how this is going to score pts. with likely Sarah Palin supporters. They hate PC and anything vaguely associated with empathy. Hence this diary and Limbaugh's reaction.

( | parent )
I'm tempted (#205839)
by Wagster on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 1:52pm

To call this something that's not PC.

( | parent )
You're defending Rahm's bang-up job on HCR? (#205848)
by catchy on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 2:37pm

.

( | parent )
I'm doubting (#205969)
by Wagster on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 10:44pm

That his aim was to have it fail.

And I really don't know where you get your certainty on some quite opaque political issues, like the behind-the-scenes actions of officials, or the hidden pliability of certain senators. You're apparently not only a fly on the White House wall, you can also peer into people's souls. Remarkable.

( | parent )
Sort of. (#205972)
by Desidiosus on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 11:20pm

There are some facts we do know:

1) There have been regular complaints from House and Senate officials that the White House has been "absent" on Health Care Reform. It's fairly clear that this is a policy decision.

2) The White House has also been adamant that it has No Friends On The Left. Lefty legislators and civil society leaders are regularly attacked in the strongest possible terms, while righties like Lieberman, despite having extensive available leverage, were coddled at every step of the process.

3) The whole thing took a very, very long time, and some of the delays were nonsensical.

There are some conclusions one can draw from this:

A) Obama is playing 11th dimensional chess. Fundamentally, this notion is neither provable nor disprovable.

B) Reid is a complete moron who doesn't understand how the Senate works. Unlikely.

C) The White House believes there is some benefit to a very drawn-out process that leaves the final outcome in doubt.
Ci) Never explain by malice which can be explained by incompetence. Fundamentally, getting a piece of legislation this enormous and vital through a legislature with Republicans is extremely difficult, and errors in process are to be expected.
Cii) The White House is playing some game in which either failure of HCR or extended periods of life support are an acceptable outcome.

I find Cii more credible than Ci. I am more than willing to entertain other possibilities.

( | parent )
Hee. (#205823)
by Desidiosus on Thu, 02/04/2010 - 12:55pm

Yeah, if there's one thing Palin supporters have displayed, it's an affection for ideology over constituency.

( | parent )
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