Diplomacy Game ForvmIV


I have created the 4th Forvm Diplomacy game.

It will be played on the 1900 map.

I have decided to let players choose their own countries, on a first-come, first-serve basis. So the sooner you sign up, the more likely you are to get the country you want.

The name of the game: forvmiv

The password: edro

How to join the game:

(I) If you haven't already done so, please register at TheDPjudge. It's easy and free.

(2) Choose which available power you want to play, and then send an e-mail to dpjudge@floc.net that reads as follows:

JOIN [POWERNAME]@forvmiv [password] edro
SIGNOFF

...substituting the name of your own preferred power for [POWERNAME] and your own preferred password for [password].

I have chosen a number of alternative rules, which I will explain once the game gets going.
--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

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Can someone... (#99122)
by Wagster

... teach me how to send press using just email, no web interface?

--

More Wagster!

Sending press via email in Diplomacy (#99125)
by hobbesist

It's pretty simple, really. If I were playing Britain, my PW were leviathan, and I were sending press to France, I'd send the following in the body of an email to dpjudge [at] floc [dot] net:

SIGNON Bforvmiv leviathan
PRESS TO F
Dear France,

Don't worry! I'm coming to help!

Yours,
the Prime Minister
ENDPRESS
SIGNOFF

And you needn't send separate emails for separate bits of press, either. So if I wanted to send separate notes to France and Germany:

SIGNON Bforvmiv leviathan
PRESS TO F
Dear France,

Don't worry! I'm coming to help!

Yours,
the Prime Minister
ENDPRESS
PRESS TO G
Dear Germany,

I'm totally yanking France's chain. Whatta maroon!

Yours,
the Prime Minister
ENDPRESS
SIGNOFF

And to send press to multiple parties, you just list the powers' initials one after the other:

SIGNON Bforvmiv leviathan
PRESS TO F
Dear France,

Don't worry! I'm coming to help!

Yours,
the Prime Minister
ENDPRESS
PRESS TO GI
Dear Germany & Italy,

I'm totally yanking France's chain. Whatta maroon!

Yours,
the Prime Minister
ENDPRESS
SIGNOFF

And, last, to send a broadcast, just use 'BROADCAST' in lieu of the 'PRESS TO' line:

SIGNON Bforvmiv leviathan
PRESS TO F
Dear France,

Don't worry! I'm coming to help!

Yours,
the Prime Minister
ENDPRESS
PRESS TO G
Dear Germany,

I'm totally yanking France's chain. Whatta maroon!

Yours,
the Prime Minister
ENDPRESS
BROADCAST
I need to move the deadline back a few days so I can plan a really devastating stab of someone who thinks I'm his ally.

Sorry for the inconvenience!
ENDPRESS
SIGNOFF

You can use either 'ENDBROADCAST' or 'ENDPRESS' to end a broadcast, but you must used 'ENDPRESS' to end a regular press.

Hope this helps!

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Thanks nt (#99140)
by Wagster

...

--

More Wagster!

Updating my updated predictions. (#99093)
by Pere Joseph

Well, dear reader, your correspondent had mixed success in predicting the outcomes of this contest's first year. Let us take a moment to consider.

What I Got Right

  • Austria: The Archduke looks, to my eyes, to be in as good a position as I'd expected him to be. He secured two builds, and faces no obvious threats in the coming year. The challenge facing him is future growth: whence will it come? Turkey and Germany will both be tough nuts to crack; will he consider leveling the first real stab of the game, and move on Italy or Russia? Your correspondent wouldn't rule it out.
  • Britain: Well, to be precise, I got my revised prediction right. Indeed, if anything, that revision didn't do justice to how good of a year Britain had. Not only did he take the outright lead in supply centers, but he can look forward to at least one, maybe two, easy pick-ups for next year, and there is no obvious challenger to his dominance. Normally, these would be excellent conditions for the formation of "early leader syndrome" - but even if it were to befall him, Britain's remove from the Continent should work to his benefit. I think, dear reader, we have our early favorite.
  • France: Well, France fared a little worse than I'd thought, but my (again, revised) prediction was more or less right. So what went wrong? Not being privy to the details of the discussions (France's or his neighbors') that took place, one can see that a fleet in Marseilles was a major defensive liability; that leaving Iberia unminded is to the unalloyed advantage of Britain; and that - true in any case - France is especially vulnerable to coordinated attack in the early going. France, too, is an early favorite - to be the first eliminated, I'm afraid.
  • Italy: Again, my revised prediction turned out correct; my initial prediction, less so. This is entirely a function of a successful alliance against France, and the neutralization of France's Mediterranean-heavy strategy. Italy has the potential, in my humble-but-considered opinion, to become a real force in Europe by means of dominance in the Mediterranean - but there are real obstacles to be faced before that can happen. Will he face trouble from the east (whether in the shape of a center-hungry Austria or a resurgent Turkey)? Will Britain lay claim to the western Mediterranean before he can? Worth watching, in any case.

What I Got Wrong

  • Germany: Perhaps too leery of perceptions of his power, the Kaiser imprudently gave Sweden away - without gaining a secure eastern front thereby. This is not to suggest that one should count the Second Reich out: Russia's hold on Sweden is tenuous, and his incursion into German territory is hardly sure to lead to German losses. I failed to foresee the shape that the first year would take for Germany, but I do not (yet) disavow the belief that the Kaiser will be a force to be reckoned with.
  • Russia: Two builds! Congratulations to the Tsar on that success - though one can't help but point out that an unsupported move into Rumania, along with a covering move from the Ukraine, would've achieved the same effect, without letting that rogue Turkish army into Sevastopol. Now it will be very difficult to extricate that army without creating a cure worse than the disease. So Russia is by no means out of the woods - Sweden is vulnerable and Sevastopol might become a lingering problem - but there's reason for a cautious optimism in Petrograd.
  • Turkey: One build! Even if gained surreptitiously, that single build might make a world of difference to the Sultan's efforts. Already blessed with perhaps the strongest defensive profile of the great powers, a single unit in Ankara could help cement the Turkish lines against an Austro-Russian assault (long enough, at least, for one or the other to tire of the effort and look to other, easier targets); a unit in Damascus, on the other hand, would be able to traipse into Egypt unopposed. With Greece already assured, a second build would be a real boon to the Sick Man's convalescence.

My sister has information you would find (#99095)
by Mata Haris sister

to be very interesting.

Like it matters! (#99059)
by Bernard Guerrero
grumble grumble (#98867)
by catchy

buncha gamers going back in time to fight or whatever ze hell you people are doin.

I'm Not Going To Be Able To Count On You. . . (#99013)
by M Scott Eiland

. . .for a front-page vote when I review the 4E D&D books, am I?

Spoilsport. :-P

--

You can count on me, Scott. (#99023)
by hobbesist

I'll vote early and often--at least 2d6+3 times, in fact.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

You know what they say, catchy... (#99006)
by vinteuil

...the squeaky wheel wants to get greased.

C'mon. Sign up for forums_crossed. You know you want to.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

Don't bother. (#99011)
by hobbesist

He doesn't have the stones for it.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Yeah... (#99021)
by vinteuil

...yer probly right.

He'll never be more than a wannabe, staring upon our sinewy thighs...

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

What? (#99027)
by HankP

he's just trying to retain whatever minimal social skills he has and keep himself from getting beat up by the other philosophers.

... man, getting beat up by philosophers. How much worse could it get.

--

I blame it all on the Internet

Getting beaten up by medievalists. -nt- (#99030)
by hobbesist

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

I'm not even sure that's possible nt (#99032)
by HankP

--

I blame it all on the Internet

"In destinies sad or merry (#99036)
by Model 62

true men can but try."

Gawain! (#99056)
by vinteuil

N/T

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

New game forming. (#98857)
by hobbesist

I bring you the fifth Forvm game, named 'forums_crossed' (in anticipatory honor of players joining from over at our frienemesis site, Swords Crossed). The privacy password is 'KNIFE', so your sign-up email (sent to dpjudge[at]floc[dot]net) should look like so:

JOIN forums_crossed [yourpassword] knife
SIGNOFF

...where [yourpassword] is, of course, replaced with a password of your choosing.
(Also, I've enabled power choice, so if you want to play a particular power, your sign-up email should look like:

JOIN [powername]@forums_crossed [yourpassword] knife
SIGNOFF

... where [powername] is replaced by one of the 7 powers. N.B. that on the 1900 map, it is Britain, not England.)

If you have trouble signing on, making sure everything in the 'JOIN' line is on the same line of text; that 'SIGNOFF' is on a separate line of text; and that, if you are specifying the power you wish to play, that your email program does not convert that part of the text into hypertext.

I doubt this will be a problem, but for those already playing in vinteuil's 'forvmiv' game, please hold off a day or two before joining, so that those who missed out on that game are sure to be able to sign up. Also, since this game will have at least a couple first-timers playing, I'd encourage anyone who has experience playing the game, but who doesn't want to play in this one, to join as an observer.

I'll explain the (few) optional rules I've added once the game gets underway.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Two spots filled (#98884)
by hobbesist

... and five remain.

And with catchy joining up any minute now, it'll be four before you know it!

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Three spots filled in 'forums_crossed' (#98952)
by hobbesist

- and four remain. Who wants to take a crack at Germany, Austria, Russia or France?

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

hobbesist, you might want... (#99004)
by vinteuil

...to post a forums_crossed diary. I doubt whether anybody's listening here, anymore.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

Maybe what I'll do, v. (#99009)
by hobbesist

... is wait until after W1900 in 'forvmiv', and I'll take the liberty of posting a dual-purpose Diplomacy diary. Doesn't seem quite worth cluttering up the right side of the screen for a glorified 'want ad'.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Perfect. N/T (#99018)
by vinteuil

N/T

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

It looks like (#99026)
by HankP

I'll have to do some sort of "Diplomacy corner" is the new design - when I can get to it, that is.

--

I blame it all on the Internet

Right... (#99091)
by Wagster

You mean Diplomacy ghetto. Why not make us wear cloth stars too?

When you're a prospective conqueror of Europe everyone looks down their nose a you.

--

More Wagster!

I would think (#99098)
by HankP

that pink triangles would be more apropos.

--

I blame it all on the Internet

What ... (#99107)
by hobbesist

my thick black-rimmed glasses and all-too-apparent lack of physical grace aren't enough?

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

I resemble that. (#99100)
by vinteuil

N/T

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

It was meant (#99104)
by HankP

as a joke, didn't mean to offend.

--

I blame it all on the Internet

My take on vin (#99111)
by tomsyl

is that he shrugs off hits like a Raiders lineman (I'm thinking Howie Long here).

--

In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.

What's a lineman? (#99112)
by vinteuil

And who's Howie Long?

I assume that shrugging off hits is a *good* thing?

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

You are the only person I know who doesn't like Glenn Campbells (#99113)
by tomsyl

"Lineman for the County."

Lineman = very large person with homicidal intend while on teh football field.

Howie Long. 6'5", 270 lb. One of the greatest of same ever.

Shrugging off hits: After a forearm to the head, lineman says "did a mosquito just bite me?"

--

In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.

I'm more confused then ever. (#99118)
by vinteuil

What would a homicidal football player be doing laying telephone wire "for the County" - assuming that I have correctly figured out what Mr. Campbell is singing - or, more precisely, *warbling* - about?

Sometimes I really do think that I was born in the wrong century.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

same... (#99105)
by vinteuil

...here.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

Anyone interested in a(nother) game of Diplomacy? (#98791)
by hobbesist

I imagine not much interest is going to be generated with the offer languishing deep downthread, so I thought I'd be a little more outgoing about it: since at least one interested party missed out joining the current Diplomacy game, and there are two other interested parties besides, I'm thinking about starting a new Diplomacy game. I'd be inclined to run it on the 1900 map, but I'm open to alternatives if someone wants to try something different.

Also, for anyone interested, would you prefer a more-or-less straightforward set of rules, with nothing too fancy? Or - as one option - would people be interested in playing a blind game (powers can only 'see' units that are next to their own units or home centers) with touch press (powers can only communicate with powers whose units are next to their own units)?

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

A forvmv diplomacy game suggestion (#98839)
by Bill White

Use identical rules as forvmiv and invite the top seven players from the two games to a third game. Make both games "no draw" for example.

Allow choice of power in order of results. Solo by 1911 chooses before solo by 1913 for example.

Then perhaps by reverse order of elimination or perhaps by aggregate supply center count to rank the remaining players. If you play on both boards your weaker result is tossed out.

This adds some meta-gaming interest, IMHO.

Ideally we should try to get at least 4 or 5 players in forvmv who are not part of forvmiv. 7 would be optimal of course. I will play two games at once if need be however I will freely defer to anyone not playing in forvmiv.

Vinteuil and mmghosh are two. Maybe we should post at Swords Crossed looking for a few more new players. Originally founded by Trevino and Armando we at least share that common history.

--

Fence post turtles -- They don't get up there by themselves, some moron had to put 'em there.

This would be my first game (#98842)
by EnderSC

I am interested. Hopefully with the rules not terribly prohibitive for the newbies :)

You wouldn't be the only one, Ender. (#98845)
by hobbesist

(Nice to see you here, by the way!)

And as for the rules: the game itself is pretty new-user friendly, and I'm now inclined to make a very bare-bones game in terms of optional rules.

In fact, stay tuned: I'll make the thing presently.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

When he says "user friendly" (#98853)
by tomsyl

he doesn't mean it's not cutthroat - it is, at least to this naive spectator.

--

In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.

Well, tom (#98856)
by hobbesist

... for the one joins, qua user, it's very friendly; qua player, not so much.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

that's alright (#98855)
by EnderSC

cutthroat is the way to go.

thank you :) (#98851)
by EnderSC

Good to be here! Hope we get more players. Sounds very interesting.

I'm not sure, Bill (#98840)
by hobbesist

that I'd run a blank board game if I had my druthers. (If that's what the people want, of course ... .) And I'm all for getting more people involved, but maybe brendan'd have more success recruiting over at SC than a stranger like yrs. trly.

And if we get enough people playing with enough regularity, maybe a ranking system, or 'playoff' games might be fun; I don't think we're really there yet.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

All perfectly legitimate points . . . (#98843)
by Bill White

Maybe we need a forvmv diary and hash out where we are.

--

Fence post turtles -- They don't get up there by themselves, some moron had to put 'em there.

The line has already been baited and set (#98841)
by brendanm98

Let's see if we get any nibbles =)

--

Come, my friends. 'Tis not too late to seek a newer world -- Tennyson

Thanks, brendan! -nt- (#98847)
by hobbesist

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

I noticed those two rules... (#98812)
by vinteuil

..."blind game" and "touch press" among those available - and, to tell the truth, I think they would drive me crazy.

I certainly wouldn't wish them on anybody playing his first game!

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

True. (#98815)
by hobbesist

Not the best choice for a first game. I take the point.

Maybe the time after next, then.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

I don't think I like this game (#98790)
by brendanm98

I already feel like I have to go back on my word to *somebody* and I can't decide who, and even though I realize that's part of the game I'd much rather accommodate everyone.

Oh well. Prepare to be stabbed!

(Tiger is starting to look sharp after [yet another] horrible start -- he's getting predictably cutthroat as the finish line approaches. I'll try to think of diplomacy as like golf -- everyone else has to lose so that one person can be champion.)

--

Come, my friends. 'Tis not too late to seek a newer world -- Tennyson

Now that I've discovered (#98758)
by Pere Joseph

Now that I've discovered that, though absent from the map, there are indeed fleets in Algeria and Egypt, I thought I might amplify the train of thought that was begun by a consideration of the effects of the 'BLANK_BOARD' rule.

Of the seven Great Powers, four - Austria, Britain, Italy and Russia - chose the 'standard' compliment of units to begin the game. I shall begin, though, by attending to those that have opted for a novel set-up.

France
La IIIe République makes a bid for Mediterranean domination with fleets, rather than armies, in Marseilles and Algeria. Make no mistake about it: this is a risky maneuver. France has abdicated its ability to make a claim on (or at least to have its say in the eventual disposition of) Switzerland, and Britain and Italy both may look with shared anxiety at the prospect of an altogether French-dominated western Mediterranean. But that prospect, if it were to materialize, would give France a solid and relatively secure source of supply centers, which centers would equip her well to advance claims to her east. France has acted boldly, and we should expect stunning success or abject defeat.

Germany
What an interesting choice from the Kaiser! One can imagine quite a bit of head-scratching in the various continental capitals - in London, though, one must imagine nothing but relief. An army in Kiel, if it sends any signal clearly, sends one of ... no, friendship is too strong, but perhaps respect for, even deference to, British naval preeminence in the North Sea and the better part of its littoral. Mind now, Germany has by no means forsworn the four center first year gain your correspondent had mentioned earlier; mark the following (and I use the esteemed Bill White's suggested notation):

Kie-Den
Ber-Bal
Col-Bel
Mun-Als/Col

To be followed by:

Bal-Swe + Den
Als/Col-Net + Bel

Now if the Reich adopts a more humble policy of growth, or is more magnanimous to its neighbors, do not, dear reader, mistake the nature of the thing. Alms have naught in common with danegeld but the coin.

Turkey
The Sublime Porte's second fleet is an unalloyed advantage. Whether it moves into the Black Sea in force, or makes sail to the Aegean, it remains your correspondent's firm opinion that the Turk is no one's sick man. This is not to say that the Sultan can look forward to clear skies, with his armies moving from strength to strength, but one should keep an eye on his progress. (Should the Sultan have built a third fleet in Damascus - triple-down, so to speak, on a naval approach? By no means. That army is in a position to compensate for potential weaknesses in defense by moves to Armenia or Konya, without losing its ability to freeze the British fleet in place in Egypt.)

Britain
With respect to Britain, the blank board offers little real incentive to adopt a different complement of forces; perhaps an army in London or Edinburgh, but certainly not in Egypt. As I have mentioned, the Prime Minister should be relieved at the German builds - a relief tempered, perhaps, by distress at the Mediterranean situation. He can also take some relief at the Tsar's decision to take a fleet on the southern coast of St. Petersburg, rather than an army (to say nothing of a northern coast fleet!).

Russia
And speaking of the Tsar - one can imagine, come the end of the first year's spring, a sense of optimism dawning in St. Petersburg: the Sultan has set sail for the Aegean from his capital's port, and is dead-set on retaking oft-held, oft-lost Egypt; Germany has decided to place a lock on the lowlands, moving into Belgium & the Netherlands both directly, while that sole fleet ambles toward Denmark; Austria opts not to press claims to Romania, content with Serbia, maybe intending to contest with Turkey for Bulgaria and Greece. One can also imagine a bleaker picture: Germany staking a claim, incontestable for the time being, to Sweden; Austria aiming for Galicia and Romania; a Turkish fleet perching menacingly atop the Black Sea. Which will greet our Tsar? Better: which does the Tsar anticipate? On the basis of which shall he make his plans?

Austria
One can hardly blame the Archduke for taking an army in Trieste. While a fleet would give him a say in the Mediterranean - and an Archduke who wishes to stand astride Europe will have to have that say eventually - more immediate concerns press themselves. Like his Russian counterpart, he likely grapples with questions for which he does not have sufficient answers: does the second Turkish fleet presage conflict between the Sultan and Tsar, which conflict brings a rise in the value of Austrian friendship? Does a powerful Germany carry secret ambitions for an Anschluß avant la lettre? If the answers to these questions are not to Austria's liking, that third army will look less like a wise choice, and more like a necessity.

Italy
One suspects poor Italy wishes he could have that decision back; a Roman fleet would give him parity with the French, instead of facing the prospect of almost immediate encirclement. The sole benefit of France's fleet-heavy stratagem is that Italy need only bow and scrape in a single foreign court to gain access to Switzerland, rather than two. Whether this increase in dignity translates to material advantage - well, your correspondent has his doubts. The choice of an army does, however, confer a certain flexibility of options: he can likely secure Switzerland for himself with moves to Venetia or Piedmont (while setting up an attack on Austria or France while he's at it), or he can attempt to send the army across the Ionian to Africa. Having the sole land unit in the region would confer an advantage not to be overlooked.

Some Predictions
Austria will end the year +2, having his choice of allies in the east, and a secure position in the Balkans.
Britain will end the year +2, but will find himself irrelevant in the Mediterranean.
France will end the year +2, his Mediterranean gambit having paid off in the short run, but with ominous signs from his east.
Germany will end the year +3, having given up his chance at a fourth build in the hopes of avoiding "early leader syndrome," Germany will nevertheless appear - and be - the early leader.
Italy will end the year +1, appearing - and being - the smallest fish in the pond. Bigger fish will already be circling, hungrily.
Russia will end the year +1, facing neither the best or the worst case scenario - but it will be more bad news than good.
Turkey will end the year +2, looking like the betting man's "dark horse."

Updated Diplomacy Predictions (#98834)
by Pere Joseph

Austria
I stand by my prediction unreservedly - though one infers coordination between Austria and Russia, given the moves to Silesia and Bohemia, which came as some surprise. A very good year for Vienna awaits, all in all.

Britain
I have not shied away from asserting it would be Germany who would appear the power to watch in the early game; events have, to some extent, given the lie to this assertion. Indeed, with the Kaiser likely to be occupied by his Ostfront, it is Britain who will likely be the early leader, in position if not in supply centers outright. I am revising my prediction to a +3 year.

France
Your correspondent wrote that the two-fleet strategy constituted a "risky maneuver," likely to result in either "stunning success or abject defeat;" the latter appears to be on the horizon. Barring the immediate and severe deterioration of relations between Italy and Britain, things look very bleak indeed for Paris. I am revising my prediction to a +/-0 year.

Germany
While my prediction, I believe, captured the essence of the German approach for the opening year, I must confess that I failed to see as active an Austro-Russian alliance as there appears to be. While this will not change the Kaiser's gains, I must acknowledge that his position looks more fraught than it did before the first season's moves.

Italy
Italy identified and seized upon the weakness of France's Mediterranean strategy; it appears that fixity will pay off. Assuming Italy can keep friendly relations with Britain, it appears Rome will become a force to be reckoned with in the Mediterranean. I am revising my prediction to a +2 year.

Russia
Saved from the loss of Sevastopol by what one can only assume was a positively epidemic spread of hashish-use among Turkish sailors, Russia has reason to be optimistic - but not too much. The assault on his Black Sea port has been delayed, not canceled, and Russian growth (and your correspondent has not changed his opinion on that score) may not be sufficient to meet his tactical needs.

Turkey
Alas, poor Turkey - "no one's sick man" but his own, I'm afraid. Sailors looking for work should apply in person in Ankara; follow the trail of severed heads to the port. I must revise my prediction to a +/-0 year, though he is not out of this fight yet.

Switzerland? (#98703)
by Model 62

Just did a doubletake. Normally Neutral -- and off-limits -- Switzerland is a capturable SC in this variant?

Hah! (#98706)
by hobbesist

I'm with Wags - no way you're manning Austria, Italy, Germany or France. (And so I get one step closer to deducing everyone's identity!!)

But yeah, SWI's a supply center in 1900. I think that's one of its more compelling features, myself.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Okay, so you're playing either Russia or Turkey. (#98704)
by Wagster

...

--

More Wagster!

Or England. (#98705)
by Model 62

:)

Vinteuil, check your email. (#98637)
by hobbesist

The ALG/EGY 'blank board' problem's been solved.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Arrgh. Missed out. (#98635)
by mmghosh

Not my fault, Emirates. Next time!

What a shame! (#98636)
by hobbesist

(Unless you didn't miss out, and this is some kind of misdirection ...)

Games in the past have taken upwards of a week-plus to form; this was remarkably fast. If there were enough interest, we could run parallel games. I'm not sure there is (yet), though.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

I will play in two if there is interest (#98639)
by Bill White

Maybe we plan a third game by invitation to the seven highest scores from the two initial games.

Of course, preference should be given to people NOT signed up for forvmiv and I wouldn't want to exclude someone from forvmv who missed forvmiv but if we need to make seven, I'm in.

V, mmghosh & Bernard would be three to start us off, right?

--

Fence post turtles -- They don't get up there by themselves, some moron had to put 'em there.

I could probably... (#98664)
by vinteuil

...be persuaded.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

If I hear (#98673)
by hobbesist

... one or two expressions of interest, I'll go ahead and make the game. It certainly wouldn't fill as quickly as this one did, but might as well put the option out there.

EDIT: I meant one or two more expressions of interest. I'm counting Manish, Bill, vinteuil--anyone else up for a (or another) game?

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

According to his BG's edit, Bill (#98640)
by hobbesist

... he did get in.

But I'll happily run the game if enough people want it.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

I'm in. Just let me know. (#98756)
by mmghosh

And no, there was no misdirectional strategy (or was there...)

The Blank Board (#98593)
by Pere Joseph

One should expect that the ability to choose one's starting units will have some effect on the relative strengths of each power's starting position. After some consideration, I've decided to offer my own thoughts on the matter.

EDIT It looks like Britain retains his fleet in Gibraltar given the blank board set-up, so a few changes are in order.

Stronger
Germany
Could the Behemoth of the continent get any stronger on the 1900 map? Well, why not? With the ability to build fleets in Kiel and Berlin, Germany's ability to have a +4 opening year - usually a rare feat, achieved only by the most skilled and daring Kaisers - is practically assured.

Turkey
The Black Sea is perhaps the most consequential space in the "Eastern Triangle." With the ability to put fleets in Ankara and Istanbul (what infidel has left it named Constantinople?!), that sea is Turkey's exclusive provenance. I suspect Turkey's diplomatic standing in the opening turns to rise significantly as a result.

Even
Austria
The Dual Monarchy's position is no worse - but no better, either.

France
I am tempted to place France in the 'weaker' category, due solely to the increased potency of Germany, but that increase only marginally increases the danger of encirclement France always faces in this variant.

Italy
With France's circumstances now clarified, there is no reason to downgrade Italy's position. It is now merely normally handicapped, instead of being especially so.

Weaker
Britain
While retaining his Gibraltar fleet means Britain remains a force to be reckoned with in the Mediterranean, the problem with his prospects for first year gains remains. With Russia's ability to build an army in St. Petersburg, and Germany's ability to take Sweden, Britain might have added trouble taking Norway in the first year, and a world of trouble in holding it.

Russia
Russia's case is perhaps the most complex. The Tsar benefits from increased flexibility in build options in Sevastopol and St. Petersburg, with the latter potentially giving fits to his rival in London. But with his two neighbors, Germany and Turkey, looking strong, I cannot but rate the Tsar's position weaker. Indeed, with Sweden all but assuredly closed off to him, and Romania (as always) an uncertain thing, can Russia have much hope of gaining a center in the first year? I think he cannot.

I look forward to hearing others' thoughts on the matter and seeing their corrections of my lapses in judgment.

A further update to my considerations. (#98644)
by Pere Joseph

According to my sources, there is some confusion regarding France's and Britain's ability to choose the units that shall occupy Algeria and Egypt (respectively). If they do have this option, then I should be inclined to keep Britain's standing the same - building an army in Egypt would be akin to opening 1.a4! - but to increase France's position. The potential to put fleets in both Algeria and Marseilles (although a stratagem not without its risks) might deliver the Western Mediterranean to M. le President at a stroke.

I await the results of this very interesting first season with 'bated breath.

FYI... (#98591)
by Bernard Guerrero

....I wasn't online when the rest of you los...er...night-owls signed up, so I'm out. However, if we get the inevitable "I can't handle the pressure of having to pay attention to this!" drop-out, I'll be happy to take over.

EDIT: Nevermind, it appears I got in. The first rejection was a syntax glitch.

--

The ultimate result of shielding man from the effects of folly is to people the world with fools. -Herbert Spencer

Waving the flag (#98546)
by Bill White

--

Fence post turtles -- They don't get up there by themselves, some moron had to put 'em there.

You're a glutton for punishment (#98551)
by hobbesist

... ain'tcha, Bill?

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

If that is the right flag . . . (#98554)
by Bill White

Maybe it is, maybe it isn't.

But as V explained, people will figure out my messages soon enough anyway.

--

Fence post turtles -- They don't get up there by themselves, some moron had to put 'em there.

Bill, it's when you write... (#98670)
by vinteuil

...(e.g.) "Vie-Boh + Bud" (meaning Vie-Boh/Bud S Vie-Boh) that you give yourself away. It's a very efficient abbreviation, but you seem to be the only Forvm player who uses it.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

I learned that from an extraordinarily talented (#98678)
by Bill White

Brazilian e-mail Diplomacy player and I immediately admired the efficiency. That is important when typing long e-mail missives.

--

Fence post turtles -- They don't get up there by themselves, some moron had to put 'em there.

Maybe we could all agree... (#98680)
by vinteuil

...to adopt that notation as a Forvm-Diplomacy convention.

It would certainly have shortened some of *my* press.

And it's not only *efficient* - it's also *intuitive*. The very first time I got a message from you using it, I immediately understood what you meant, even though I had never seen it before.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

Those always get you. (#98671)
by hobbesist

How folks write out orders in press is the surest sign; once somebody gets used to writing them in a certain way, it's very hard to adopt--and maintain--another way of writing.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

I've spoken with the Archduke (#98641)
by Colonel Sponsz

and I've spoken with you. I can say with some degree of confidence that you, sir, are not the commander of the kaiserlich und königlich forces. It's the writing style, dontcha know. A dead giveaway to one with some small experience in espionage.

--

By the whiskers of Kurvi-Tasch!

Dude, like you can't fake writing styles? (#98642)
by Bernard Guerrero

Hell, two games back I actually told somebody who I was and they didn't believe me because I wasn't verbose enough.

Besides, people can fake tells. It's not like I write business memos with smiley faces on 'em.

--

The ultimate result of shielding man from the effects of folly is to people the world with fools. -Herbert Spencer

I remember that, BG. (#98648)
by hobbesist

And maybe it was just because, as GM, I knew who was who to start with, but I remember thinking, "Are you kidding me? Of course that's Bernard!"

And if you want to stay anonymous, it's smart to hide your tells. It can be hard, though, to recognize just what your tells are. I think I know a couple of mine, but who knows how many I'm neglecting?

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Some of us have tells (#98651)
by Jordan

which can be difficult to mask.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VD7_7SXsHU8

--

Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. -JH

Yessir! (#98655)
by aireachail

* tugs "Old Man Pants" back up to mid-waist *

They don't make 'em like that anymore.

--

Excess on occasion is exhilarating. It prevents moderation from acquiring the deadening effect of a habit. - W. Somerset Maugham

Well played, sir! -nt- (#98652)
by hobbesist

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

It's possible (#98645)
by Colonel Sponsz

But unlikely. Unless both correspondents are working to mimic one another's usual writing style.

--

By the whiskers of Kurvi-Tasch!

Some can. Some can't. (#98643)
by Pere Joseph

And some don't.

Update: positions are going fast! (#98540)
by vinteuil

Germany, Austria & Turkey are already taken.

That leaves England, France, Russia & Italy.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

Update: going...going... (#98589)
by vinteuil

Just one power left: France - a winner in the last two games!

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

Gone! (#98595)
by vinteuil

We have liftoff, in record time.

I will be sending all players an introductory message explaining variant rules etc. as soon as I can get it written.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

NO_DRAW? (#98537)
by Model 62

Erp.

Does that mean we're going for solo victories?

It does a lot (#98553)
by hobbesist

... to change the dynamics of alliances; arguably, it works in favor of the powers that traditionally fare worse (Italy & Austria, especially) by giving the powers that start big out of the gate less reason to collude among themselves in the opening seasons.

On the other hand, there might be good reason to help a fellow player jump out to an early and significant lead--so long as you can help him come down with a case of "early leader syndrome" thereby.

(In either case, though, it's bad to be Germany!)

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Yup. (#98538)
by vinteuil

Enough of this pussyfooting around!

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

I will admit... (#98584)
by Wagster

No draw probably makes the game more interesting. But let me lobby you against the weak bounce rule, see if I can't get you to change your mind. It seems to me that it would:

1, Make the game more defensive, less swashbuckling.
2. Actually remove, a lot of the time, an important tactical calculation... whether to support or go after the other side's supports.

--

More Wagster!

Another Vote Against (#98602)
by Model 62

Strong bounces contribute to diplomatic play as bounces can be pre-arranged to mask intentions, to provide plausible deniability, and to enforce DMZs.

OK, I'll put it to a vote... (#98590)
by vinteuil

...once we have a seventh.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

Good points. -nt- (#98588)
by hobbesist

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Thanks, vinteuil. A word of caution. (#98521)
by hobbesist

I tried 'blank board' once with 1900; IIRC, there are some problems with Britain and France that are caused by using it. First, (again: IIRC) those powers' players will not get to choose whether they have armies or fleets in EGY & ALG*; they're 'locked in' as a fleet and army respectively. Second, Britain will not start with a unit in GIB; rather, his three builds will be available in LON, LVP & EDI (as they'd be in a standard game).

When I ran a blank board game, I had to do some pretty extensive manipulation of the status file in order to get the set-up to look right. This was when the GM's screen was just the status file, though, so I'm not sure how to do it now.

And 'no draw'? Why am I not surprised?

*Come to think of it, they may not start with units in those spaces at all.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Thanks, hobbesist... (#98523)
by vinteuil

...for the word of caution.

I realized that the units in EGY & ALG would be "locked in," since they're not home supply centers. But I'm surprised to learn about Gibraltar. That seems like a real glitch.

As for the "no draw" rule, I'm really curious to see how that will will work out. And I'm even more curious to see where the "weak bounces" rule will lead.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

I'm always here (#98525)
by hobbesist

.. to rain on your parade.

I've never played a game with 'weak bounces' before. That will certainly add a lot of complexity to tactical considerations. I'm not a big fan of the 'no draw' rule; the one game I played with that rule really should've ended in a 3-way draw. (Though I came out with the solo, so I don't dislike it that much.) It'll be interesting to see what becomes of this game.

And if you run into problems with the status file, I might could help.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Also, for those signing up (#98522)
by hobbesist

... if you want to select the power you play, the sign-up email should look like:

JOIN [POWERNAME]@forvmiv [password] edso
SIGNOFF

EDIT: Since I notice someone's signed up without having chosen a power, if he did want to so choose, he could resign & rejoin using the sign-up command above.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

I'm getting... (#98526)
by Wagster

Invalid JOIN command. I'm using your syntax (but the password I'm using is 'edro', as Vinteuil gave it to us.) Any ideas on where I'm going wrong?

--

More Wagster!

"edro" is right. (#98542)
by vinteuil

Try signing in. I *think* you're on board.

--

God help the while, a bad world I say.

All right, all right (#98552)
by hobbesist

... I made a typo; I admit it.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

No idea. (#98528)
by hobbesist

Here's the DPJudge explanation:

You'll use the JOIN command, which has the following syntax:
JOIN gameName password
-or-
JOIN [powerName@]gameName password
If the game is a private game, you will need to add one more word to the end of your JOIN command. This is the game's "privacy password," which you must obtain from the GameMaster. Is is in this way that games can allow access only to a specific invited group of players.

If all that stuff is on the same line, it should work. I'm at a loss.

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

Got it... (#98585)
by Wagster

Two tips, if anyone is having problems.

Make sure the email is plain text.

The syntax is case-sensitive.

Joining is a lot more challenging than actually playing the game.

--

More Wagster!

It's case sensitive? (#98587)
by hobbesist

Huh. I never realized that.

(The plain text problem, I should've realized--some email programs see the '@' and convert the thing into a link to an email address.)

--

Brevis esse laboro, obscurus fio.

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